I just finished reading the blog that Dr. Morey and some people (old good friends of mine over there) at Faith Community Church posted several days ago on biblicalthought.com. The author is Stephen Macasil. He came after I left so I never met him (to my knowledge). The whole thing truly made me sad and grieved. As a Christian, I just do not understand these ways of dealing with things against other brothers and sisters. But then today Dr. Morey posted a reply to Stephen's entry. And what he said utterly grieved me. Below you find what Dr. Morey said. I would ask you if you read this to look for any sign of love. Can you find any sign of sorrow over those who served at that church under him for so long? Is there any sense of willingness to have hope of reconciliation with any of these people? Now, I do not believe what he is saying here, I think he is dead wrong, but I will relay his words here for any reader to see. I think that his tone, his attitude, and his “joy” over such things speaks for itself.
Dr. Morey (said):
Dear Fellow Joy-filled Brothers,
I offer the following insight as to why some of those who leave FCC experience nothing but bitterness, rage, and hatred in their life.
“To whom much is given, much is required.”
These people grew greatly under my teaching and pastoring. God blest their lives. They experienced the best fellowship and joy in their Christian life while at FCC.
Then they were tricked into leaving the church by con men who used groundless slander. They did not bother to follow Matt. 18 and violated 1 Tim. 5:19. They did not deal with their sin but covered it up.
They never found a church where they experienced the same level of joy or teaching or pastoring. They float from church to church and end up going nowhere at all.
Sitting alone in their misery, they stew with bitterness that they are not back at FCC being blest. They see FCC members growing and being blest. They become jealous of them and end up hating them! The apostates have been left out of the blessings. Instead of repenting of their sins, they act out their frustration by attacking FCC and its leaders.
“Misery loves company.”
They want to trick FCC members into the same miserable life they have in the hope that they will regain the joy and fellowship they experienced back when they were together at FCC. But the hatred and anger eats them up inside and even when they get together, they end up venting their anger at not being at FCC. They talk more about Dr. Bob now than when they attended the church! How sad.
This is why Clark’s “church” fell apart. He tried to recreate the joy he experienced at FCC, but his lies and deceit finally came home to roast and the people grew tired of his hate speech.
Tom Maxham is not happy or blest. He has not been able to go on in his life with positive things to do and say. He is frustrated with the truth that he threw away his chance to be part of FCC by disobeying the leadership of the church. He dug his own grave. But, instead of accepting the guilt for what he did, he lashes out in pain and misery by blaming other people for the mess. He is feeling guilty for violating all the counseling principles he taught others. He is now doing what he condemned Clark for doing! Like a wolf, he has attacked the weak sheep he counseled and made them promise to violate Matt. 18 and 1 Tim. 5 by not checking out his silly accusations. His shame comes up as acid in his stomach. He cannot look at himself in the mirror. He is one sad miserable man.
How can these miserable, sad, bitter, people escape the snare of the devil into which they have fallen?
1. They must not cover their sin by blaming others. Adam and Eve tried to shift the blame off themselves to others. They are responsible for the choices they made. Blaming Dr. Bob, Cindy, etc. will not help them.
2. Admit to themselves and to others that they have sinned and this is why they are not being blest with those who attending at FCC.
3. If they saw the joy and fellowship we had at last Sat.’s Men’s breakfast, they would become angry and jealous that, while we were experiencing joy, they were being miserable.
3. They must apologize to those they conned into leaving FCC and tell them to swallow their pride and go back to FCC in repentance.
4. They must understand that while they can con some of the people some of the time, they will never be able to con all the people all the time. Thus they will fail at shutting FCC down. Dr. Bob will go on writing and preaching the Word. His new book will prove to be a great blessing. They are only speed bumps on the road of ministry.
5. They forget that Jesus promised that when His servants are persecuted and accused of every evil thing, His blessing on their ministry will increase in direct proportion to the attacks made upon them. The more they slander him, the more God blesses him!
6. Thus I am not depressed or dismayed by their silly and stupid accusations. They are making great rewards in heaven for me!
7. I spend my time doing the Lord’s work, such as writing the new book, while they spend their time doing the devil’s work, accusing the brethren. I am dancing with joy while they are screaming in rage!
8. I am encouraged by their attacks. You only get this kind of flack from the devil when you are dropping bombs on his stronghold. But, Satan will not distract me from writing the new book. Clark, Joel, Tom, etc. are only the flack that comes up when you are over the devil’s stronghold.
So,
Be bold,
Be brave,
For the Lord thy God is with thee.
Do not be dismayed;
Do not be depressed.
Walk in faith and victory
For the Lord thy God is with thee!
Apr 14th, 2008
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12 comments:
I connected to your blog through another FCC member's blog, and I want to thank you for speaking out about what has been going on there. My family left about two months ago due to the kind of abuse of power that you describe in your last post. How funny that all of the FCC outcasts are supposed to be 'banding together', yet this is the first contact we have had in years!
A few of my dear friends from FCC have recently contacted me because they are concerned with my spiritual condition and do not want me to be led astray. My reaction to this was 'huh'?? because I didn't realize the extent of the gossip and hearsay that is being spread at FCC. We left over organizational issues and what we felt was continued abuse of unchecked power. I understand that my friends are confused because we did not tell them anything about why we left, but the truth is that they will not understand. I know this because over the years I have believed everything I was told about other people that left too, and never considered whether the things that were said about them were true. I have since repented deeply of this sin against my Christian brothers and sisters. I am not saying that every person that has ever left FCC or had conflict was completely in the right, for I don't really know. But the point is that that I DIDN'T know, and I believed based on hearsay that people who had only displayed good character in my experience were doing evil. I also jumped to conclusions about people because of all of the rhetoric that was espoused. I hope that someone reads this and can keep from continuing to commit the same sins that I did. I honestly think that all of this stuff about people sending emails and claiming things about Dr. Bob and secretly meeting to try to tear down the church is just fearmongering. I have never heard a scrap of the gossip that is supposedly going around the circles of 'outsiders'. These vicious gossips are doing a terrible job! He uses these tactics to throw people off of what the real issues are, and to make them scared to investigate what is really going on in that ministry.
The real reason why I am commenting here, as I don't usually do this kind of thing, is to testify for Tom Maxham's good character. I am literally weeping all over my keyboard for the evil things that have been written about him. I am in utter disbelief that Dr. Bob has gone so far as to say that he, and you, and Clark is unregenerate and wallowing in misery. Bob Morey truly answers to no one, and is committing the most grevious sin in presuming the salvation of people based on his personal disagreements with them.
While I don't know anything about the situations of you other two, we have been in weekly fellowship with Tom Maxham. I have been so uplifted by the way that he has handled the evil that is being done towards him. He served so faithfully at FCC without pay, blessing many people, and he does not deserve what has happened. However, Tom has not lashed out, but rather looks to God's sovereignty in this situation. He has truly modeled godliness in persecution--especially since the persecution is coming from other believers! We have been spending our times of fellowship with the Maxhams and other families who recently left FCC praying for the Lord's direction in our lives and fellowshipping in joy. We are relieved and joyous that we have been delivered from this situation with clean consciences. We are all actively seeking Christian fellowship at other churches, and have found several that seem great. Absolutely no one even remotely fits the description that Bob Morey has written here. I'm sorry, but we all have to fulfill God's purpose for our lives, and we do not have any more time to waste worrying about Bob Morey.
He is the one that is obsessed with what everyone else is doing. Every personal problem is not the devil trying to split the church. How can people continue to believe that every person, previously thought to be godly, that has a conflict with Bob Morey is an agent of Satan? I am praising the Lord that I have been delivered from that mindset. Yes, I am sad for some of the relationships that I may no longer have on this earth, but God's people will always meet again. We are longing for that day when the Church will be united and perfect.
I express the same deep frustration at the lack of restraint on Dr. Bob's part to control his mouth. I saw a transcript of this one radio show he did saying "fag" left and right, a word that makes gay people completely turn off to whatever message comes next. He questions everybody's salvation and then accuses others of spending all their time trying to bring him down.
One of the main reasons I left the church was because while there is a concern to present the gospel to people, there is little to no concern to present it in a way that people may last listening to them for more than a minute. There is no effort to "contextualize" whatsoever and thus, the seeds of the gospel (in a sense) are crushed in their hands before spreading it over good ground. This all makes me really sad because I believe Dr. Bob could have an amazing ministry if only he wasn't so prideful and slow to admit when he's wrong. They need a board of elders to restrain his words since the Bible seemingly doesn't do it for him.
-Sam
rachael,
"I honestly think that all of this stuff about people sending emails and claiming things about Dr. Bob and secretly meeting to try to tear down the church is just fearmongering. I have never heard a scrap of the gossip that is supposedly going around the circles of 'outsiders'. These vicious gossips are doing a terrible job!"
From what I understand, one of the emailers is Joel Hughes, the author of this blog. He sent it to someone in the church who turned it in. If you want to read it so you know why things are the way they are, ask Joel to share it with you or blog it openly on his blog.
The claims about Tom are from people he actually met with privately asking them to keep the meeting secret. They reported it to the church. Other people have reported that Tom told them things in counseling that he said to keep private not wanting it to get to Dr. Bob. So they are not fearmongering made up to distract any attention anywhere. There is also slander from Joel Hughes in his email to the person he was trying to get to leave FCC saying that Dr. Bob left his PA church in disgrace after stealing money. The head deacon from PA wrote a letter rebuking that claim and also was sent to Dr. Bob's 35 year anniversary in CA to give a testimony to faithful ministry.
John,
I do not know who you are, but again I would counsel you to not fall into the sin of believing gossip and hearsay without seeing firsthand evidence. Your comment "from what I understand" epitomizes the problems with the way Bob Morey deals with people. The fact is that he is publicly attacking a man without public witnesses. When refuting another scholar, the proper thing to do is to present their writing and then demonstrate how it is in error. However, whenever any kind of personal conflict comes up between Bob and someone at FCC all of the sudden there are all of these "secret" informants reporting secret things. Is that not the very definition of gossip? Even if the things that you say are true, which I will not believe they are unless the person/ people who were sent these secret emails and participated in these secret meetings come forward, there is nothing that remotely warrants this:
"Tom Maxham is not happy or blest. He has not been able to go on in his life with positive things to do and say. He is frustrated with the truth that he threw away his chance to be part of FCC by disobeying the leadership of the church. He dug his own grave. But, instead of accepting the guilt for what he did, he lashes out in pain and misery by blaming other people for the mess. He is feeling guilty for violating all the counseling principles he taught others. He is now doing what he condemned Clark for doing! Like a wolf, he has attacked the weak sheep he counseled and made them promise to violate Matt. 18 and 1 Tim. 5 by not checking out his silly accusations. His shame comes up as acid in his stomach. He cannot look at himself in the mirror. He is one sad miserable man.Remember, all liars shall have their place in the lake of fire. (Rev. 21:8)."
and from the earlier post
"In obedience to the Word, I do not consider the “Legion of Doom” members, (eg. Joel, Clark, Tom, etc.) fellow-Christians. As long as they continue to run their “Liars Club,” they give no evidence of regeneration."
Again, I have been in constant fellowship with Tom Maxham and several other families who have left FCC. I have personally seen nothing but godly behavior from Tom since he has left FCC. He knows that he is called to further his counseling ministry, and thus has enrolled in school to pursue further education. He has attended church services and publicly worshipped every single week. He testifies to the sovereignty, grace and mercy of God every time that I have met with him. Of course the man is probably deeply hurt by the things that are being said about him, by the very ministry to which he gave so much service, but I do not see any evidence of bitterness. The description of him written here is absolutely preposterous.
Damning someone to hell, as Bob Morey has done, based on hearsay and petty grievances is serious sin. This kind of thing should only be said about someone who is publicly engaging in serious sin over a period of time or publicly attacking the gospel. Tom Maxham has not done either, not by a long shot. I will not stand by idly while a friend's character, reputation, and very salvation is slandered without proper justification. In his arrogance, Bob Morey is bearing false witness against and judging the heart of another believer, which is a job that belongs only to God. Js. 4 I rebuke him for this sin with the full authority of the Word of God.
I would like to add that every time someone leaves FCC because they do not approve of the way that Bob Morey runs the ministry and treats people with whom he has conflict, they are not being dragged off by the devil and his minions. This is what I mean by fearmongering. We wish to support ministries that not only proclaim the gospel of grace publicly, but apply the gospel and grace to all of their personal dealings. I suppose that telling people that we are being conned by the devil and his minions, and that we cannot experience a healthy spiritual life apart from FCC, will scare them enough to not investigate the matter. I know this because I have been duped by this very ploy in the past. No doubt they are telling people not to talk to us for fear of being dragged away by the devil too! I hope that people will be able to see through this and rationally and prayerfully evaluate the way the ministry is treating people.
Thank you for sharing your experience with us Joel. I am shocked and saddened to see Morey stoop as low as he has in spewing out such hatred and rage against you, Clark, and Tom. His tone and language are enough to give one a full picture of what a dark state of mind he is in. He loves his sin and continues to refuse to admit the things he has done. He enjoys his predatory role over weak and faithful sheep. Every time his sin is exposed he can’t help but lash out with the most vile and inane responses. According to him, it is now impossible to both leave Faith Community and retain their status as a regenerate believer.
After reading the depths that he has plunged to in attempt to slander the reputation of you, Clark, and Tom, I think it is time to release the ten page letter you referred to in part 1. It would comfort those already hurt/scarred and educate/warn those still being threatened and tormented by fear. I know many people that would benefit from you doing this Joel. It would be completely called for given the fact that you gave him your word that this would be your recourse and he refuses to take that warning seriously.
Rachael, I greatly appreciate your comments here. It not only encourages me but will also do so for dozens of others who read it. The same goes for both Sam and Joshua. I tell you, I am rarely surprised anymore by any of these antics that I hear that that man does, but the recent blogs and comments over there from the cool aide crew have really made me sick. I can't believe that they could stoop so low as they have.
Thank you also Rachael for testifying for Tom Maxham. He is one of the humblest Christian servants I have ever met. Dr. Morey shoots himself in the foot because the stories he makes up over and over about such trusted servants are simply so outrageous, that they are unbelievable. The many people who knew the Maxham’s, the Mulroney's, and the Robirds, to name a few, should know better. But the red punch is strong. There is much more about this I could say and will when the time is right.
But let me address the comments made by John. You are correct, I am one of the emailers. But some context and clarification needs to be made. I emailed a friend of mine that still attends that church for his mailing address. In passing I asked him how he made sense of the fact that over and over the core leadership of that church leaves and is later slandered with all sorts of unbelievable accusations. He responded back to me by saying that the way he sees it, Dr. Bob has done nothing wrong, has only helped all these people, and that all these people (including myself) leave because they are prideful. Well, that really got me going so I wrote him back a three page response where I laid out just the basic facts, mostly public information. I have zero problem posting my emails on this blog for it will only further show the guilt and sin of Dr. Morey and also vindicate the good testimonies of many of these people burned by him. But I doubt people want to read all that stuff. But give me the word.
I have a hunch this "John" may be John Morey, but I may be wrong. Anyhow, "John" said: "The claims about Tom are from people he actually met with privately asking them to keep the meeting secret. They reported it to the church. Other people have reported that Tom told them things in counseling that he said to keep private not wanting it to get to Dr. Bob."
Please dear reader, see this trick here! This is the very tactic they use over and over and over and over against good people that challenge or question ethical behavior over there. It is always some "person" or "people" who reported that they heard this stuff. I could name names of who they have done this to. Again, read my first blog on the abuses of Morey where I posted Phil Rosenthal’s article. He describes this tactic. These people will never come forward because they do not exist. Morey did this very thing to Clark Gallagher. Read Clark's open letter to Dr. Morey found here: http://www.cchighland.org/robertmorey-openletter/
and see where Clark repeatedly calls for these similar "accusers" who allegedly reported all sorts of nonsense about him. It was later demonstrated when he pushed them hard enough that there were none. They were lies. Yet Morey did a public slander job of Clark from the pulpit on a Sunday morning. One more thing, you have it backwards John. Tom would keep his counseling sessions private from Dr. Bob because Dr. Bob repeatedly would use this confidential information against these people later. John, the King has no clothes on.
Finally, let me clarify what I said about the PA incident and him stealing money. There exists a six hour DVD made against Dr. Morey from ex ministry partners when he was in PA. Six hours! I have these DVDs and will make them public when the time is right. They have ample documentation of fraud and theft.
As for the cool aide crew at biblicalthought.com, I am deeply saddened. I was good friends with Drew and Mario and it just grieves me to see them talk the way they do about all these people. There is a frightening intoxication that is going on over there. If one of them jumps on my term of affection, “the cool aid crew,” I only have to say, as the old drug commercial went, “Dr. Morey, I learned it by watching you!” And it will not surprise me a bit if next I hear them saying, “Joel said that Dr. Bob is taking drugs and says the bloggers are all drunk!” That is the modus operandi, at least, of Dr. Morey. I also want to express very clearly, that I am not bitter, angry at the abuse of myself and my friends, yes, but not bitter. But I have sat silent for too long and taken too much slander against myself and now so many good people. In the words of that great Vietnam vet, John J. Rambo: “They drew first blood sir! I didn’t want this war, but they wouldn’t leave me alone.” But, uh, well, time will prove that for many reasons I am the wrong person to pick a fight with. However, I will fight properly and biblically—with truth. Just the facts man. For Morey and the crew to use the type of inflammatory rhetoric that they are using against other fellow believers, calling us “apostate,” “fallen away,” “used of Satan,” “reprobate,” etc. are not the marks of a Christian church guided by love, but rather are marks of a cult.
My 10 page resignation letter will be posted on the blog tomorrow.
A six hour DVD!Now that will definitely need to be seen to be believed, especially after the letter read and circulated last Sunday at FCC testifying of Dr.Bobs good standing upon leaving the PA church.
Yes. I have the DVDs at my house and others have them also. Stay tuned...
I want to strongly concur with Joel and Rachael and vehemently disagree with John. I became extremely angry when I saw what Robert posted about Tom Maxham. So much so that I didn’t even mention him when I posted here before because I knew I had to cool down first. After the anger subsided, I became mostly saddened - tearing up as I thought of all of the wonderful memories of the great man that is Tom Maxham. John, I’m sorry but you must’ve never met him.
I have known Tom for a few years now and I would like to testify that I have never met a person like him in my life. This is the most caring and selfless man I have ever known. I am a college student who spent a some time in counseling with Tom and remain friends with him to this day. I never had much of a father but when I got to know Tom, he taught me everything I needed to know: not only about what a Christian’s life should look like but also what I should strive to be as a man. The care and attention he gave in helping me with anything I needed was like nothing I’ve ever seen. Never lashing out in anger or judgment but always gently guiding me to follow Christ in the most practical ways.
You’re right Joel that Morey sure shot himself in the foot in saying these things about Tom. Anyone that has even spent a few minutes with Tom would know how laughable these lies are. I spoke to Tom right after this whole thing happened and just a few days ago. His attitude is exactly how Rachael described. He has moved on, is thanking the Lord, and is immersing himself in his studies.
Joel: your posts are a continual encouragement. Please, don’t even feel the need to justify yourself about what Robert Morey and co. is saying about these “satanic emails”. You are doing the right thing. I never could’ve imagined Morey and co. (over at “biblical” thought) stooping to the lows that they have. Morey sure has a way of brainwashing people into a comatose state where they spend their time parroting everything he says and refusing to question any of his actions. That website has turned into a frenzy. Anyone who even questions Morey (not Jesus, not the Bible, but this man) is labeled a heretic and an antichrist.
“These people will never come forward because they do not exist. Morey did this very thing to Clark Gallagher. Read Clark's open letter to Dr. Morey found here: http://www.cchighland.org/robertmorey-openletter/
and see where Clark repeatedly calls for these similar "accusers" who allegedly reported all sorts of nonsense about him. It was later demonstrated when he pushed them hard enough that there were none. They were lies. Yet Morey did a public slander job of Clark from the pulpit on a Sunday morning.”
You couldn’t be more right about this. These are bold faced lies just like the ones about you, Tom, Clark, etc. Its funny how you guys have all been completely open about your experience and provided tons of evidence and Morey can’t do the same. He can’t provide any rational account of the events that transpired but instead talks about Tom’s stomach acid.
“Finally, let me clarify what I said about the PA incident and him stealing money. There exists a six hour DVD made against Dr. Morey from ex ministry partners when he was in PA. Six hours! I have these DVDs and will make them public when the time is right. They have ample documentation of fraud and theft.”
Is this in reference to Larry Wessels? He is a brother out in Texas who has written materials and a documentary detailing how Morey stole a large sum of money from him. If not, are there even more people that Morey has done this to?
“As for the cool aide crew at biblicalthought.com, I am deeply saddened. I was good friends with Drew and Mario and it just grieves me to see them talk the way they do about all these people. There is a frightening intoxication that is going on over there.”
You again hit the nail on the head. I’ve never seen people behave the way they’re behaving on that website. It is getting very, very scary. They have all of the hallmarks of a cult because they’re being lead by someone who has all of the hallmarks of a cult leader.
Some examples (I tweaked this from one I found on the net):
(i) Taboo topics - questions that can't be asked, doubts that can't be shared, misgivings that can't be voiced. Eg, “where does all the money go?” or “why are so many people leaving the church?”
(ii) Secrets - the suppression of information, usually tightly guarded by an inner circle.
(iii) Spiritual Clones - in its minor form, stereotypic behavior, such as people who walk, talk, smoke, eat and dress just like their leader; in its much more sinister form, psychological stereotyping, such as an entire group of people who manifest only a narrow range of feeling in any and all situations: always happy, or pious, or reducing everything to a single explanation, or sardonic, etc. (this is a big one over at “biblical” thought).
(iv) Group Think - Party line is created by the leader’s opinion which overrides what the Bible actually says. Eg. Morey says someone who disagrees with him is on their way to hell à the kool aid crew chants it from the proverbial rooftops without thinking twice.
(v) FCC is the elect - shared delusion of grandeur that there is no way but this one. The corollary: you're lost (and slandered) if you leave the group.
(vi) Loyalty tests - members are asked to prove loyalty to the group by doing something that violates their personal ethics. Eg. People are being encouraged to lie about and slander former members of FCC to prove their loyalty to the leader.
(vii) Duplicity - the group's public face misrepresents its true nature. Eg. All this talk about Scripture but when Scripture comes into conflict with the leader - Scripture goes out the door.
(viii) Totalitarianism - Morey is telling his members what they are and are not allowed to read online and also who they are and are not allowed to speak to. Eg. from Glenn’s blog: As absurd as it sounds my church, Faith Community Church in Irvine, has issued a letter in the Sunday (April 6th) announcements asking us to not read blogs, emails or websites which attack "FCC." In addition I am not to "receive any letters or calls from them."
(ix) Authoritarian Structure - The leader is regarded as the supreme authority. He or she may delegate certain power to a few subordinates for the purpose of seeing that members adhere to the leader's wishes. There is no appeal outside his or her system to a greater system of justice.
(x) The leader is determined, domineering, and charismatic - Such a leader effectively persuades followers to abandon or alter their families, friends, and careers to follow the cult. The leader then takes control over followers' possessions, money, time, and lives.
Wow Joshua! Thank you and you also hit the nail in the epicenter. Thank you for putting so much time into your comment. I believe that as more people become aware of this blog these comments sections will grow huge with a multitude of similar testimonies from people who had first hand experience over there. Stay in touch.
I just want to commend those who have posted comments and others who are now speaking out about Dr. Morey. I am encouraged to speak up and tell my story. We must not fear man but God alone. Many of us, ex-members, have tried to leave FCC in silence. Not wanting to harm the sheep anymore than they already have been. But it is almost impossible to leave that church on good terms. I pray others would come forward and let the truth be told.
Hey Joel, howzit going bro, hope all is well man! God bless, Ed Enochs
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